Insightly_Ep09_final
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Jordan Walker: [00:00:00] Alyssa?

Alyssa McGinn: Jordan

Jordan Walker: I am so excited for today!

Alyssa McGinn: Interview number two.

Jordan Walker: Interview number two. First time using the podcast tables here at Shocker really good about this Feeling really good.

Yeah. The reason why I'm so excited, though, is because of these ladies in the middle of us. We have two very special guests on today, and I have been just itching to have this interview with you both.

The two people that we have with us are two individuals that I've had the pleasure of working [00:01:00] with but also learning a lot from over the last few years and so I'm just looking forward to seeing where this conversation goes today. With us, I'm gonna start over here, we have Miss Emily Stewart who is the Director of Digital Marketing and Data Analytics at Meritrust Credit Union.

She's a part of ~the Gross Strategies team. And ~the Growth Strategies team, their entire mission really is how do we use data to create a stellar member experience for those that we serve in our credit union. And that is one of the first things that I was ~like ~super attracted to when we first met. And as we've had a chance to work together, I've gotten to know Leah Webb here.

Leah is the Growth Analyt Analyt Mm, Growth Analyt

Oh my gosh, why can't I say it now? Analytics manager. Growth analytics manager. I was just saying, I love how that rolls off my tongue, and now I can't say it. Growth analytics manager at Meritrust Credit Union, and literally data [00:02:00] queen at the organization.

Like, anytime we're like, we need to understand this, we need insights for that, Leah's not only the first person to say, yeah, I can pull that, but if we haven't done it before, it's, well, here's how I think we can do it. ~it. ~

So. I'm just excited. Thank you both for being here.

Leah Webb: Thanks for having us.

Emily Stewart: Yeah, thank you for having us. We're excited to come chat with you girls.

Jordan Walker: ~Yeah. ~

~Well,~ we're ladies of data.

Emily Stewart: Yeah.

ladies of data.

Jordan Walker: Well, before we really get into the nitty gritty of, ~you know, ~work and some of the efforts that you're involved in with data, Emily, why don't you kick us off? ~And I'm just curious, ~Tell us a little bit about how you got into data as a career field and just what that journey has looked like for you.

Emily Stewart: You know, gosh, I want to know how far back I go to the story. But ~ me, ~I just like being a problem solver. And when you are having, when you have a career right now, especially in a financial institution, but really anywhere, The, ~the power is, ~power is with data, right? Success is with data.

Knowing who [00:03:00] your customer is, what they want, what they need is how we find success as an organization. And there is no magic eight ball and there is no more gut feelings in business. And so where my journey really came was just evolving, ~being a, ~being able to evolve with business and being willing to make that evolution.

And when I go back a little bit further, I go back to, and I don't know if you guys are old enough for this, but back in the day, girls were kind of told you weren't good at math. ~And I don't, hopefully that's not true anymore, but ~I was definitely even told that by my loving mother who would say, you know, oh, I'm not, you're just not very good at math like me.

And then I remember taking college algebra and getting ~really ~100 percent in the class and the teacher being like, you really should think about going further into this and Me having that realization like I really love this class. This is one of the things I've loved the most and I loved the logical aspects of it and I loved that there was a solution and that you could study and ~you could ~get ~a ~100 percent [00:04:00] on a test ~and ~because you understood, ~you know,~

Jordan Walker: It was a clear result.

Emily Stewart: It was clear results.

~And so, and I, you know, was further down the line on, you know, college, but I was like, I kind of looked back on that and thinking I should have really kind of explored more in that space instead of my liberal arts and sciences degree, but got into my career.~

And my first job was actually at Boeing Wichita Credit Union, BWCU, that's now Meritrust, but I was always the problem solver in my department for technology or different things or reporting and things like that. So it just kind of kept becoming more and more of my responsibilities. And over time it just now is a big part of it.

So ~that's, ~that's the evolution for me.

Jordan Walker: Yeah, so you started working at a retail branch and now you're in a corporate role ~and you've kind of bounced a little bit around. ~

Emily Stewart: Well, I thought was been in back office, but it was member facing actually in collections, ~but~

Alyssa McGinn: Oh, that's fun.

Emily Stewart: I know, or special accounts back then, ~and~ but I always ended up being like, Oh, you're the person that really understands technology.

And they were like collecting out of phone books and I was like, there's this thing called Google and let's use it. I mean, this was a long time ago. But you know, when you're in a department with a lot of people that aren't very tech friendly, you kind of end up getting like more and more projects.

And I, you know, I would say for anybody that's entering into their career, if you're kind of the person that's like, Oh, [00:05:00] you're the guy that can figure this out or gal that can figure this out. Like embrace that because ~then ~that is ~how exactly, that's ~how I ended up getting, Hey, Emily can do this project.

Oh, you can pull this report. Oh, you're really good at pulling reports. Oh, you're really good at compiling data. And that's how I became like system admin of this or, ~you know, ~got put on this project and then it just catapulted my career because ~I, so it doesn't necessarily mean you have to start in the IT department I didn't, but it ~I made a name for myself for being able to problem solve and work in technology and ~before thinking and work, ~work in projects to problem solve different various things and that catapulted my career to where I am today.

Jordan Walker: Leah, you had a kind of a similar type of journey. Talk about that.

Leah Webb: Yeah, so I started at Meritrust when I was 19. I was a part time teller, so I was working at a branch for almost six years while I was in college.

And I had kind of gotten to this point in my retail, like, career where I was bored.

I didn't have to figure out how to do things anymore. And I was also finishing a master's degree in communication. So I knew that I would be looking for something new. And so I talked to [00:06:00] our talent development team and they had mentioned that there was a growth strategies team that would likely be creating a position for a growth analyst in the coming months. So I got really lucky to be transferred over to work for Emily on the growth strategies team. And I think it's kind of funny because at the beginning of my career, I knew a lot about the credit union.

I had some education and analytics from like my media analytics and audience behavior class and quantitative analysis where I use like SPSS for data analysis, but I didn't really even know how to create a pivot table in Excel.

Jordan Walker: And I would have never ~have ~guessed that because I feel like you walked into that role and it was already magic.

Leah Webb: No, no, thankfully I had Emily to help teach me how to use Excel, ~but ~once I got a good grip on Excel, ~like ~Emily would give me a data set and be like, okay, let's do it. What are some insights? Tell me about it. ~And I'd be like okay, that's, that's that's terrifying, but okay. ~So that started coming more naturally.

And then I was able to get access to Tableau and I was like, okay, this [00:07:00] data visualization stuff is really cool, ~but there were, ~Data sources that were built by our business systems data team. Mm-Hmm. that serves the whole organization. And then I realized, okay, I think I actually need a little bit more customization whenever I'm creating these tables and data sources.

And now I'm like writing SQL scripts in order to gather data and analyze it. So yeah, ~it's, ~it's wild. ~Yeah. ~I love that evolution. ~Yeah. Yeah. ~I definitely did not expect to be here. I knew that, well, I had a feeling that I had some aptitude for analytics and I thought that's what I would be interested in But I'm very relieved to find out that this is my niche.

Yeah, this is what I'm good at for at least as far as I know

Alyssa McGinn: I for people that are listening that maybe it feels intimidating or that you need to have some sort of formal education. Yeah. Talk about like what it was like learning on the job and like somewhat self teaching yourself.

Leah Webb: Well the first thing that I always like to tell people is ~that there's I think ~that It's so much more common to be analytical than people [00:08:00] think. I think it's really just like Emily had said, problem solving. So I think just understanding your skills as analysis is a huge step in becoming more comfortable with taking on learning and teaching yourself, but also being comfortable not being good at things and like creating something very ugly, ~like.~

Like in the meantime, it's okay. You're going to look back ~in the, ~in two months and be like, wow, that was really bad, but that's okay. Because today is better.

Jordan Walker: Yeah, that step was necessary ~here.~

Leah Webb: Yeah, absolutely. I think it's just being comfortable with that. And also having people that understand you're learning, you're getting better.

And as long as you keep moving forward and trying new things, it's going to be okay.

Emily Stewart: So I have a fun story about Leah starting or how ~she was, ~she was placed with me. So I was doing some research on members that were being acquired. ~So you obviously, ~if you work at any financial institution, ~you're on, ~you want to ~go and ~understand. ~How are you receiving, ~how are you getting new members or new customers?

~And ~You look at the product or the location or various different [00:09:00] avenues in which ~that ~you acquired the member, right? So you can back into their journey. And I was doing some research cause there were some data anomalies that were coming through about members that were basically being system acquired.

And we were like, where did these come from? And you really have to know that's sort of the benefit of me. Working originally on the front line and also the benefit sometimes of high, you know, hiring from our retail staff Is that boy they know our product services and systems and so and I did too I know how to do lots of random things that are front end things in the system because of that because my history So I was digging in trying to figure out these data and all the anomalies ~These one offs of the system that required, required things.~

And I could tie back to the individuals that were involved at the branches. And I actually was doing a ton of research and reaching out to tons of frontline staff. And I remember one person in particular got back to me ~this, ~this information that answered the question and research. With ~so, so much in depth, ~such an in depth response.

We had never met each other. [00:10:00] We had never done anything. I just Teams chatted her. And I was like, hey, can you tell me why this person, like, you know, what happened here? And she had such an analytical answer and response back. And she was, you know, a member service representative. Is that what they call them now?

At the branch. ~And when then ~Maybe a month or two later when the name got floated back to me from HR ~when she talked ~I was like, yep ~Yeah, ~that's exactly the and so you just never know what interaction she had no idea that we were gonna opening a position or anything like that, but ~like ~that kind of response that level of I'm curious too.

~And I'm going to look, look into this and I, ~and not just sort of like, eh, just leave it at face value. I mean, she took the time to respond to me. She didn't have to use any fancy system. She didn't have to know Tableau to answer this question. She just dug in to give me the answer. And I remember it made a difference in the research I was doing and it helped solve my question.

And so, it's just amazing to me to look back at those little moments and you just [00:11:00] never know when those moments affect

Alyssa McGinn: Were you trying to impress her at that point?

Leah Webb: No, I really just wanted to know the answer to the question.

Jordan Walker: Leah is just also very helpful. Yeah. Yes, I think that's Like, your, that genuine curiosity that you just mentioned, I think, like, that's the quality that I see ~yeah. ~most often in anyone, ~and we talked a little bit about this in our last interview that we had, ~and it's if you have a passion just for digging in and asking questions, like if you like kind of being a detective, you like, you've already mentioned problem solving, like I love logic puzzles, I love riddles and things like that because I want to understand how it's connected, I don't see the immediate connection, That's exciting to me, and I feel like that kind of realm is like the common denominator for anyone that gets into this kind of realm of things because

And I've had students ask me the question of like, well how do I get into analytics?

What platforms do I need to use? And it's like, well, tools are tools. [00:12:00] It's the data set that you're working with that'll make or break. Like, you can use any of these tools. Like, you can, I guess, get into Tableau, but what are you looking at? What are you connecting to?

Leah Webb: What questions are you trying to answer?

I used to be kind of embarrassed because I would be the person that would find something random. Like, ~there was missing, you know, ~there was an S missing at the end of a word that made maybe the disclosure make less sense. And so I would be the one that would point that out and I was like, Oh, I'm sorry to bother you.

Like I found this small detail. I don't know if it matters or not, but now I realize like that willingness to look and say something even though it was like uncomfortable for a long time. I think that that's the same reason that I've been able to grow my job now.

Alyssa McGinn: I think that's so true about ~the ~the data sets and the tools is that, like, we have a junior analyst that we just brought on and she was, like, fresh out of college, didn't know Tableau or Power BI or anything like that, and we sell data visualization services, but it's not really the visualization part that's the part.

It's the data, right? It's the getting in there. It's the [00:13:00] cleaning. It's the understanding, you know, our clients model in the data. ~It's, it's so much more than that. ~ Once that's ready, the dashboard is, like, Not, I won't say easy, but like, you know, it feels easy, you know, once that's all set up.

And so I think you're right. It's like, we don't, when we hire people, we don't really care if they know, I mean, propensity towards those skills, but like, if you don't know Tableau or Power BI, you can learn. Yeah.

Jordan Walker: Yeah. Absolutely. Oh,

Emily Stewart: yeah.

Jordan Walker: Okay, so let's transition a little bit.

~So we've talked a little bit about your journey. We've started to kind of get into the details.~ Let's talk a little bit about what the day to day looks like because a lot of what Alyssa and I, when we're having kind of our nerd alert conversations in a huddle room somewhere, it's usually starting from like the challenges that we see companies experiencing and a little bit of that like fear of the unknown and okay well what do we have to stand up in order to get the results that we're looking for to get the insights that we're looking for and standing up the infrastructure is a very large part of both of your roles at the organization [00:14:00] you orgs are going through like digital transformation in a

lot of various ways~ Mm~

Humble brag for a hot second, I have watched you two take on some immense infrastructure projects and having to work with a lot of different stakeholders across the organization and really dig into the details and I've got to tell you, I've not really ever experienced a team ~team.~

Of individuals that are so willing to like be explorers and that genuinely curious like, okay, let's figure this out. We don't know, but we're gonna figure it out, you know, but very in tune with, well, this is the strategy of why we're doing it. This is the need that we have and here are the outcomes that we're trying to achieve.

So,~ So, you just do it so well. ~

Giving us what details you're able to share. Emily, give us kind of like a high level, if we're just kind of looking at the last few years of, you know, digital transformation. What are some of those like major moves that you feel have made a [00:15:00] drastic difference?

Emily Stewart: I think tearing it down to the frames is part of it. ~Unfortunately, ~unfortunately, sometimes, I mean, ~you, ~you can keep building on it, but I think, you know, if you're really talking about MarTech and customer experience.

And all of those things in your legacy financial institution or legacy company. It's ~a ~very easy, by the way, for a fintech startup to start from the ground up and start building a customer insight strategy. Because, you know, they're starting from ground zero. So we kind of have to, we have a lot of legacy systems that we play with all the time.

I think the secret sauce is probably built in a couple different things. It's still back to that curiosity mindset, right? Having a really strong team that is very passionate. about what we're doing and having really great partners, whether internally stake, internal stakeholders or external and part of that part in this vendor management and vendor processes is something I'm very passionate about because you know when you think about the economies of scale [00:16:00] of a company like Bank of America or something or Coca Cola.

They get to have hundreds of thousands of developers on staff and product teams and program managers and every, you know, specialized everything. And, you know, even though Meritrust is a large financial institution here in the state of Kansas, it's not, ~you know, ~You know, bank of the size of Bank of America, the the scale isn't there.

So

Jordan Walker: you have to be the product manager and a marketing

Emily Stewart: and

yeah. So, with that said, ~you know, you've got, you have a group of, you have to be, ~you have to wear lots of different hats, I guess I should say. And this, the scale then comes in and where you can act with your kind of new skills is either partnering with other credit unions, which credit unions do a really great job of partnering with other ones across the United States.

And you've seen us do that, where if we're stuck on a problem, I'm just, I'm so proud of the industry that we work in. I genuinely, Don't know if I'd ever find myself outside of the creating space because I just love what we get to do and we partner and,

Work on innovation groups together and do all kinds of stuff [00:17:00] So that helps us act with the economy of scale and then partnering with really great vendors that allow us ~to ~to do that as well so We have to buy technology, right?

~We can't go make our own~

All the time we can't go make our own thing ~and ~sometimes we do. ~And ~So it just kind of depends on ~what we're, ~what we're doing. But as far as that vendor relationship goes and how we can build the infrastructure, what I think is it's like, if you build, ~well, one, ~hold them accountable always but build a really strong relationship with them that's describing the vision.

If they know where you're trying to go, I promise that every vendor wants to help you get there.

Jordan Walker: And I've seen that happen with you guys.

I mean, there have been conversations that we've had with vendors together where it's like, I mean, this is what we're looking for. This is how we want it to operate. Here are the insights that we're trying to get from it. And it is very much of a collaboration of, okay, well, here's what we can do. Have you considered these other things?

And it's like, No, but let us go hammer that out for a little bit and we'll come back to [00:18:00] you.

Leah Webb: Our favorite partners are the people that we know are open to product recommendations and like, even if it's a little bit of criticism, I know it's probably their baby because I feel the same way when I get criticized.

It might feel a little bit weird but they want to get better and they want to grow their product as well as they need customer feedback feedback

Emily Stewart: in order to do that.

Yeah, they do. And it's not uncommon for Leah and I to get invited to a different conference to speak about something. And it's not just like selling their product to other clients.

It really is about Insights and how we leverage their product. ~And they're always, it was, it's always so surprising to us. It's like, well, we're using your product as design and we want more. ~And then a lot of times they're like, yeah, we can't get clients to use like 25. It's that minivan of, I bought a minivan, but I have one kid.

I think that happens a lot to different companies, especially bigger ones where they're buying off the shelf things and they're not quite leveraging it to its full extent. ~And I think that happens all too often. ~And it really is about not having a great relationship with your vendor because your vendor wants you to use it just as much as your SCFO does.

And so that I [00:19:00] think is, you know, instead, sometimes what I see is people then ~go ~want to go buy something else when they already have the product that could solve their problem.

Jordan Walker: For those that haven't listened to the last interview that we just had with Ted Kriwiel, ~we ~we had a hot Ted take on this exact concept and I'm glad to hear it actually from another group as well because ~like ~we felt very connected to that part of the conversation and ~I mean it ~it's true and he was kind of talking about it from the aspect of sometimes software gets so focused on creating the new releases and adding the new features that it starts to become.

A lot of things that companies don't actually need, but they have to keep doing that in order to build up the volume and One example that I gave in that is like HubSpot You know, there's a lot of things that happen in HubSpot But the way that they've now built their tiers is that unless you're on the full thing You don't have access to all of the things you might need and for depending on like company size You may not need all of those [00:20:00] things and I think that's kind of what's interesting though about the way that you all have approached that vendor relationship because you really are looking at the marketing tech stack that you have and identifying like what is the value that we're getting out of it right now and what do we need out of it and so you've actually taken on some like custom build scenarios and things of that nature in order to make it exactly what you need so that you maximize it ~like talk a little bit about.~

Making the decision in that direction

Emily Stewart: Yeah, I'll talk a little bit about the product and then I'll let Leah talk a little bit about our CDP.

So, you know, when we started the tech staff journey, ~you know, ~and you started, we started, ~you know, ~meeting with you. ~I, you know, ~first we needed to get our website handled, like how do we track things? How do we track campaigns? How do we track activity and journeys and all those things? And then

Marketo is the next thing we wanted to tackle and what do we want to do there?

And how do we make sure to get the data there the right way? And then it was also decided a strategic decision was decided [00:21:00] for us to build our own CRM instead of buying one off the shelf. And, you know, variety of different reasons, economic, adoptability, things like that, some great partners that we, scalability, great partners that we had available so that we could do, so we could see out this journey.

And we. Had a vision for it. ~And it, it, what, you know, there's, ~there's a lot of different things that play about like different departments and their customization and how they need it. But also how do we want to use this information to better serve our members, know our members better, and ultimately make sure that we're funneling all of this data into the right place so we can gather the right insights about our members.

~And ~It also helps because the left hand knows what the right hand's doing when we're properly using a CRM. So there's like a member facing side and then there's the customer insights and analytics and campaign performance and all the other stuff that we can get out of using a CRM properly. It's all, you know, it's the vision of a CRM.

~But on steroids is what I like to say. ~But as we started kind of getting, you know, I talked about Marketo, we have online banking, we have a push notification. So [00:22:00] we have all these different applications that are part of this tech stack. And I wish we could come up with a different word than Martech because it feels so much more than marketing.

~Right. And so,~

Jordan Walker: It's really experience.

Emily Stewart: Exactly, it's experience, it's loyalty. It's all these different things that we want to measure and understand. And then we were like, eh, I don't know if we're really getting this data. We have a data warehouse and we have an amazing data team at Meritrust. But we were like, we really need a way that we can activate, measure, deploy, intake, all this.

~I probably should have said intake first. ~Intake, activate, deploy, measure, model in one location and have that single customer view. And so, we were like, okay. ~We kept, right, ~ultimately it was a, again, everything starts out with a problem. We kept running into problems with how we were trying to figure out how to map things.

It comes with a mapping conversation. How are we going to get this to this? And so that's when Leah started working on a CDP idea internally, ~using internal~

Leah Webb: Yeah. Last summer, our chief growth officer wanted us [00:23:00] to track exactly how a new member was coming to the credit union especially online. She wanted to know which ad they were coming from, and then if they opened an account, and who they were, and kind of what they saw along the way.

~And no offense, but I thought that was insane, and I thought that was impossible, surely. ~And then I was meeting with some different vendors. I know Jordan was definitely one of those people that first introduced me to a concept of a customer data platform, or CDP. And I was like, oh. I think this is actually what we need and a customer data platform like Emily was saying, it's designed to ingest data, analyze data, and then also be able to activate your insights by delivering to some of those different customers.

Technologies, like email marketing, like that's definitely like the most common one. And as I was trying to understand a little bit more about how CDPs function, I was of course diagramming and documenting what we would want out of it. And the further I got, the more I thought, hmm, I think we can do this ourselves.

And so I pitched the idea to our data team and our developers and they were like, [00:24:00] Oh, we thought that ~So, like, ~during your 45 minute presentation, at the end of it, you were going to say, and this vendor will be able to do that. And instead, I proposed, okay, here's how I think we can get there with internal resources, and here are some milestones that we have, and exactly, like, the data points that I could see going into this.

And they were like, okay. That's definitely maybe the most thorough ask we've ever gotten, but yeah, let's do it! So, we were able to get some buy in from our data team and our developers, and start moving forward on that way to categorize and identify all of our members behavior.

Jordan Walker: It's been so cool to watch this process, ~and Just knowing that sometimes it can be intimidating to go into, you know, ~I think sometimes I talk to other clients and they're like, Oh, I have to engage IT or I have to engage like our finance department.

And I don't work with a lot of organizations that actually have like a dedicated data team yet. But there's always kind of that hesitation when you have to work across [00:25:00] different stakeholder groups of like are they going to understand what we're asking, are they going to think that I'm playing in their playground, you know, what does that look like, and so you mentioned that, I mean, the meeting went amazing and you guys have been working forward, like how do you, do you feel that like the amount of preparation that you put into it bought them in?

Leah Webb: Yes, I think that A lot of people feel that distance or frustration, like Marketing versus IT, especially when marketing is like data driven and that's in any organization. So something that Emily has always really had us focus on is building relationships with people. And I think sharing your intentions, sharing your vision, and also them seeing how prepared you're

coming to the conversation and that you have a good idea of what's actually possible. I think all of those things helped a ton in that conversation, and also throughout all of our development and like all of our different projects throughout the last couple years, Emily [00:26:00] and our Chief Growth Officer, Jamie, have done a great job of tying back to the strategic vision. ~So our other Yes.~

And our other departments know they are responsible for executing on the strategic vision as well. Yeah. So when there's a detailed plan on how to accomplish that With a partner, I think that they appreciate it because ~they need to, ~they will be answering for that at ~the end of ~the end of the ten years or whatever.

Emily Stewart: When I think about when I've worked, even when our IT and data team were a lot smaller. ~The The And ~I noticed I had a lot of success when I sat down and really thoroughly thought out what I was asking. And I would get into the habit of, and ~this is how, ~this is how I know I'm, this is where I would turn on that side of my brain. I would get into the habit of mocking up an Excel spreadsheet with the right headers.

And then I would go in and dig in and go, well, what are the actual field names? So if I wanted to report back because I didn't have access back in the day, cause I've also worked in our lending department. And I was managing some of the systems in there and I didn't have access to pull reports back then.

And so I would mock up a table exactly like I wanted with the headers that exactly that I wanted. [00:27:00] And then I would go far as to pull a schema on my system so I could find out the field names of exactly what it was called. And what I found, and this is just I don't know if this is human nature, they'd pick up my tickets first because, and so I was, so I was like reward, you know, the reward center in my brain was like, okay.

And then I got really good at making documentation. And so I had managed the API configuration, like set up between two systems worked with the developer and then it, they luckily only had, To help me if I got stuck and but I also would give back a really

great thorough documentation back to our data team about how I set something up or even back to different departments and I realized like they would use that stuff as Bible and it would make all the reports and ~it would, and I don't know if this is a little bit of laziness inside of me in the future, but ~I'm like, if I do it all right right now,

Jordan Walker: I Well,

Emily Stewart: into the future.

Jordan Walker: respect, though, you know? I mean, like, part of it is, like, your problem solving it before you have to go and make the ask, [00:28:00] or to help identify what questions should I be asking if I can't, you know, figure it out to a certain point, right? Yeah. But coming to the table prepared.

That's exactly right.

It's respect. It's, if I'm going to need, like, if we have to partner on this initiative and it's a part of the 10 year plan, like, we're obviously doing it.

There's no, there's not really a no scenario here.

Emily Stewart: I think that anybody that's listening that's like, and this is, you know, it may be another financial institution or anybody that's like, ~I'm struck. Cause we talked about this. ~I'm struggling to get my IT department to understand what I want. Or I'm just beating my head against the wall.

The truth is, I think it is about respect. I think it is about documentation, explanation, thoroughly thinking through what you're asking because they do get pummeled with all kinds of things all the time. And I think that It is one of those things that if you can kind of think through it's, you know, preventing screenshots or writing, ~you, ~you know your system better than they do to a [00:29:00] certain degree.

You use it all day. So really described like in this case, it was a loan origination system and I used it a lot more than they did. And so I was easier for me to describe, Hey, the APR field that you're looking for is called APR underscore rate.

~And so like, don't go search, like you can write the sample.~

Jordan Walker: Why waste your time going down the rabbit hole trying to look for it if I already know it.

Emily Stewart: Exactly. And so I do think, you know, it's that middleman sort of the explanation, like help them understand what you need, the cadence, the, Hey, I need it for the last 30 days. You know, you're really thinking through what you need instead of getting a ticket open, getting something back you don't want, and ~then ~then both parties are frustrated.

So I think it's really taking the time to thoroughly think through the logic of what you're asking for.

Alyssa McGinn: I think it's fair to say that documentation might be their love language.

Emily Stewart: Yes.

Yeah.

Alyssa McGinn: And I that is to the respect, like to understand what they need and want. But I'm even curious, like past IT, like what have you guys found in terms of like, we talk a lot about building a data culture and like ~the, the, ~ that can be really challenging for people who aren't, you guys are naturally data driven and that's, but not everyone [00:30:00] is.

So, what has that experience been like across other departments too? Integrated culture.

Emily Stewart: I wish our chief data officer was here because that's definitely on his, like, framework. He's creating a committee and really trying to level us all up. I saw him provide a suggestion today about a new plot type or an new. Yeah,

whisker visualization,

a whisker plot, and I was like, ooh, this is my love language.

Love it. And because we're used to seeing some data a certain way, and ~like, and sometimes And this is something I've been talking just recently with our boss about. I was ~like, sometimes it's hard to put off that, like, build it brain and is it right brain when you're talking about a data report and then shifting to the best storytelling brain and that's the data visual.

And so we had talked a little bit about, like, some ways to, you know, I don't know. We will have to figure that out. And for the next podcast, we'll tell you how to figure that out. But But, for data culture, I think in the credit union, I think that really does come from the top. And I think, you know, I am still trying to figure out how do I, how do I permeate or get the data?

Get the data that we have out there. I'm really excited. I'm going to be presenting to some of my [00:31:00] peers and the executive staff at the end of this month. ~Some of the data that my boss likes to call the Voodoo data which is, you know, our MarTech stack and all that. ~But I think that it's education and continually to talk about it because I don't think, you know, what we do isn't the most important thing that the other people do now are.

Chief Data Officer is definitely very interested in what we're up to, ~and what we're, ~and we partner with a lot of stuff, but those other departments, lending retail, those kinds of stuff, unless it's directly about them, they may not care as much about impression count on the website, and so, you know, taking those opportunities to educate, get in front, wowing them with some different slides, really thinking through what's important to them, and what they would want to know, and then tailoring it to them, I think is important too.

~Mm. ~

Jordan Walker: Another, I guess, brag moment, like from my perspective, some of the things that I think your organization has done very well in creating that data culture is just like you said ~it ~it really started at the top like creating the growth strategies team was very intentional it wasn't just about we need [00:32:00] marketing and we need ~you know ~some sales development kind of stuff it's this is going to be very data first we are going to let the data tell us ~what like you said earlier ~what our members want what our members desire And how can we latch on to that than to make other people want to be members with us as well?

And so that mentality was very intentional, and I think that really kind of started a lot of the movement. But then, as you said, there's a lot of opportunities where you guys are being pulled into Like, C suite conversations and getting pulled in front of board members. And so there's a lot of accountability, too, for the projects that, that are being created.

And I think the thing that I love about working with this team is that they're not afraid of that responsibility and challenge. ~And I, ~I would say that is like one key component that just like radiates on growth strategies. It's like more responsibility [00:33:00] to figure this out. We're on it We want that like don't know how to do it doesn't matter We're gonna figure it out.

And I think that excitement and that energy that you all put out for it makes other people interested in what you're doing. So it doesn't feel like That data stuff only happens in this dark hallway that no one ever goes down. Like no, it's a very bright and shiny area of the building, and it's very welcoming ~and, and things like that.~

And the other thing that I would just say is that when you're giving those presentations, and this is something that we've talked about wanting to do more, is not just sharing here's what's going on, and here's what, you We're seeing as wins, but it's also celebrating with those other departments. Like, Hey, remember when we ran this campaign for lending and this is what our targeting was and all this infrastructure that we had to stand up to make it happen.

Like reach, like you guys rocked it. You closed blah, blah, blah deals, or we were able to engage like these members. And [00:34:00] so there's celebratory moments in it too, that are like starting to get more filtered down to. You know, maybe it was a digital lead, but it, and while we want to make sure we understand where the credit is due just from a planning and an insight perspective.

It's still Team Meritrust, it's still everybody wins, but, you know, if a digital lead happens to walk into the retail branch and that retail individual ended up closing it, like, It's awesome!

Good for you! You know, and I think that is something that's beautiful about the data culture that you guys are still cultivating and growing, but there's definitely a lot of those signals.

Emily Stewart: Yeah, I think one thing that's been really amazing, and I'll let Leah talk about some of this, because we are, we created a new metric as a, as a collaborative effort. And it's just called our engagement member metric, and it was so thought out, so innovative, and we did it in such a collaborative

[00:35:00] way. ~And I think, ~Leah, if you wouldn't mind sharing, I'm thinking about what ~retail, ~retail gets on board, and ~a ~and then our CRM, and the trickle down effect of how and the lockstep our teams are.

Leah Webb: So we had designed this way to identify engaged members and retail knew that it would be part of their goals for the year.

So we knew that we needed to make the data visible to them. ~So ~We were like, okay, how are we going to show how each member is engaging with us on their CRM profile?

~We were like, okay, here's some ideas. ~Emily was able to mock it up and create the visualization that indicates ~how, ~exactly how a member is engaging with us.

So, if a retail employee pulls up a member profile, they're able to see, okay, they have these things but maybe they don't have this other one. So this is an opportunity for them to cross sell and they have an incentive to cross sell because that's what so it was really cool seeing the beginning to end process on, okay, here's this like very vague idea, here's a data table that has like seven true false fields and a date, and then it transforms into, okay, this is how we're going to help retail meet their [00:36:00] goals for the entire organization.

And I think it was really cool seeing that project from beginning to end and still having improvement. ~On how we're defining and identifying the engaged members in an ongoing way and understanding their behavior in general. ~It's a never ending conquest.

Alyssa McGinn: Can I add something from the outside looking in? You guys have worked together and it's my first time hearing

a lot of this stuff,

and I just love and I feel like ~so ~It's so rare that people have this idea, and it's like. Okay, we can't do it perfectly. We're just gonna stair step our way to figure it out. Like, I don't think that is normal.

Jordan Walker: ~It's not ~

This is why I love working with you.

Alyssa McGinn: Yeah, like,

Emily Stewart: That's literally how we do everything.

Alyssa McGinn: And Jordan's told me that, but I was like, yeah, you know, sure, maybe, like, but I'm like, wow, like, this is, and I just feel like so many people want, like, perfection, and so they're scared to jump into the ideas of, like, we need this member engagement.

Ranking or scale. How do we figure that out? Okay, we're gonna start with true false table. Like, that's it. We need to figure out, like, how do we approach that together? And I just, I don't know, it's just really cool to see you guys do that,

Jordan Walker: Well, I think the difference is ~like I think ~where some people ~like ~are striving or some companies are striving for [00:37:00] perfection right out of the gate it's focused on it has to be like this And this is the story that we're trying to tell like they've already decided what the end game is, right? if we get so Enamored and I can't remember who said this it somebody cool, I'm sure, but

We'll just go with Angelou.

Sure.

if you get so enamored on the solution, you're not focused on how you're problem solving it, like something to that effect.

And I think that is something that this team has adopted very well in tackling any of these kind of problem solving initiatives. It's how do we help retail get insights that they need? To achieve their goals ~and ~and create a great member experience. Well, here's one way that we could do it and this is how it also benefits other areas of the organization.

So we're gonna start here, but this metric has so many other plans that ~like ~we haven't even started scraping the surface yet. But I [00:38:00] think that's what's so cool is that ~like ~you could have the vision for it, but it starts with how do we help? How do we problem solve this and then we can grow from there?

And, I mean, that's very entrepreneurial and startup within the organization,

Emily Stewart: It feels like a, it definitely feels like a startup team.

And we've definitely then started to grow the people that are passionate about acting and behaving like that. But I think what's really cool is ~like ~to see the genesis of it, right.

It's very much like, so we see the score and then just see it resonate throughout the organization. And I think that's just part of our culture. It's like, how amazing is it that we have retail leaders that are like, yep, ~we're going to, ~we're going to set this as a goal now for art. Like, it wasn't just like, oh, that's just something growth strategies measures.

And it's like, oh no, no. Like this is like, Everybody and we're all kind of beating up me trying to beat to the same drum and their adoption of that then passion dust to go Now on the flip side here because CRM and Martek and everything that we're doing on that side and [00:39:00] being able to build it ourselves I can't believe how fast we were able to get that in there and it's beautiful And I just love I just love how that all came together Came through fruition.

So I'm really proud of that, that project and that story and Like it just really did lay out the fact that hey, we're building our own CRM and we could do this really cool thing

~it really kind of showed the value of that too, which is another project ~

Jordan Walker: Yeah,

Emily Stewart: That we, ~you know, ~building yourself actually does work.

Jordan Walker: I feel like we could continue this for another hour, but gonna have to put a cap in it. So before we walk away from today, if there are others, it doesn't have to be in the industry, but if there are others listening that are interested in, ~you know, ~You know, maybe they find themselves on a marketing team, or maybe they find themselves in a non typical data type role, but they have interest in going in this direction.

What advice would you give someone?

Emily Stewart: A couple things. Find yourself to be the problem solver on your team. So I'm assuming you have a, [00:40:00] assuming you have a job, right? Yeah. Find yourself to be that problem solver in your team that is the one that's like, I'll pull that report. I'll look that up.

I'll look into that. I mean, everybody's got Excel or Google sheets. They can play. It's, it's a table. That's, that's where we all start. And then the other thing too, to get a little more formal kind of education is I really want to shout out to the CMD classes that Wichita State has. Dr. Sue is her name that I took some classes from and and I think it's a great professional development and she'll, you know, teach you a little bit here and there.

Take, take a day or two off of work and go take those

Leah Webb: That's a good tip.

Emily Stewart: there's ~like ~some database or Excel training classes that she does.

Leah Webb: I would say, identify the skills that you have that are analytical and make sure you're calling them that. So you can, like, introduce that. I think for me, what I tell people that work in branches is the ability to, for a member to come in and say, Hey, I'm having this issue. And you to do all the research, know where to look, know where to click, have that.

[00:41:00] Curiosity and ability to deep dive like that is analysis and like any kind of hypothesis that you're proposing whether that's like scientific or maybe it's social science like all of that it doesn't matter it's analysis and those skills will help you at the end of the day.

Jordan Walker: Yeah.

Leah Webb: So just look at your resume and make sure that you're calling things what they are especially if you want to Start in a new career field that's more technical.

It's okay to ~like, ~re label something. Find a pseudonym that's related to the field and that will definitely help. And just knowing and ~like, ~being comfortable using the language, because I honestly didn't identify as a data analyst until I was working in my analyst role for like a year and a half. Because I had like imposter syndrome. I don't feel like an analyst, but now I'm like, no, I am a data analyst first of all.

Yeah. And another thing that I would suggest is just not getting caught up in that 20 percent that is still unclear. ~Yeah. ~As you're learning something, it's okay to have a conversation and understand 80 percent [00:42:00] of what's going on. ~Yeah. ~That 20 percent probably doesn't really matter that much. Yeah.

Yeah. And it's all going to click one day.

Jordan Walker: And also no one has it fully figured out. Like

that is something that I tell people all the time is that if anyone tells you they haven't figured out they're lying to you, we are all kind of winging it. But as long as you keep your eye on this is the strategy, this is our why. You can start chugging away

Emily Stewart: And it doesn't have to be perfect

~Yes~

Alyssa McGinn: and the speed of technology

Jordan Walker: Yeah, you'll never be able to figure it out. Which, okay, this is actually the final question that I want to ask before we break. We know, Alyssa and I talk to a lot of companies that are just kind of starting to entertain digital transformation and what that means for them and it can be very overwhelming because ~As you've already pointed out, ~you kind of have to like level set and really consider everything that you have in the organization currently.

For companies and leaders that are starting to really see that as important for them, what would [00:43:00] be a tip or a piece of advice that you would give to them?

Emily Stewart: Digital transformation is not a check the box or a one size fits all. There's really never done, you're never really done. And so don't try to make a plan that is like a waterfall method of done, like with a go live date because you just really have to have the mindset that it's incremental improvements.

And so that means a little bit at a time, go at, you know, getting good, this puts the infrastructure and then I would say, make sure you have the right people involved in your strategy. Do you have people that can Take you there. Do you have people that are forward thinking, problem solvers? Like, you know, not to say they already know how to use Tableau, but you've got to use data to get through digital transformation.

And so you have to have people that can help ~you get to, to pull it for ~you and know how to analyze it.

Leah Webb: I'd also say incentivize failing fast so you can figure out where what's not working. Because getting something up and running and finding what isn't working is going to be so much [00:44:00] more effective than trying to get it right the first time.

~Yeah.~

Emily Stewart: Embrace failure, fail fast.

Leah Webb: piece of

Emily Stewart: Yeah.

Jordan Walker: Thank you both for being here today.

Leah Webb: Thank you.

Jordan Walker: I'm just so glad that we could make this work and like I said earlier it's just a pleasure to be able to sit with you both and just bring our normal everyday nerdy conversations to life. So thank you. Thank you.

Alyssa McGinn: And if you guys have any questions reach out to us at helloadinsightlypodcast.

com. If you want any questions forwarded to these ladies, we'd be happy to be the conduit for that. And we'd love to hear from you and we'll check you on the next episode.

Jordan Walker: Bye!